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 Chris posted on Thursday, 08 June, 2006 - 03:34 pm
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Here's a question:
Does anyone know when Dies Irae was actually recorded?
I've often assumed that because it was released so long after sky2 (about six months?), that it might have been recorded at some point during 1980 and not late '79 as was the album.
Obviously it was the last record featuring Francis that the band released, but was it (along with the B side) the last thing that FM recorded with the band? Of course, it may have been recorded as part of the sessions that became sky2 but held over for inclusion, perhaps, on sky3? As events have shown, Francis left the band in the summer of 1980 and sky3 became a very different album than, perhaps, it could have been had he stayed. But, if anyone knows the story (and recording dates) of Dies Irae, then I'd be very interested in knowing... |
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| Bill Darlington posted on Thursday, 08 June, 2006 - 09:46 pm
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| I forget but I believe that there were two versions issued, totally different recordings. One was the on a 12" single and the other was on the Music Club CD of 'Sky'. |
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| Chris posted on Monday, 12 June, 2006 - 12:49 am
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| Thanks Bill - although I don't remember the Music Club CD version being different. Mind you, I've always found it intriguing that they re-recorded 'March to the Scaffold' a couple of years later with Steve Gray. Was this because it was a particular favourite of theirs or becauss they felt they could do a better job of it if they had another go? Questions...questions...questions... |
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| Bill Darlington posted on Monday, 12 June, 2006 - 10:03 pm
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| Maybe that's what I was thinking about. |
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| Chris posted on Monday, 12 June, 2006 - 11:55 pm
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Must have been. Never mind. My original question still stands... Does anyone know when Dies Irae (and March to the Scaffold, for that matter) were recorded? And does anyone apart from me actually care?
My theory, is that as it was such an unusual choice for a single (nearly eight minutes long and not really chart-friendly in the way that Toccata was), it was never intended as such when it was recorded. Instead it was intended for the next album but then released as a 12" single in order to get it out after Francis left. And I for one am glad that they released it rather than just leaving it on the shelf, as it's a unique sky record - unattached, as it were, to any particular album. An entity in itself and one of my favourite pieces of FM era music. |
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| Myke posted on Sunday, 25 June, 2006 - 09:49 pm
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Can't say I've ever noticed any musical differences let alone durations between my 12" single at 7:45 long, and the CD version at 7:30. I think the lengths quoted are just down to playing speed variations and long fade outs.
BTW my 12" single has a play and copyright date of 1980. |
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| Harald posted on Friday, 07 July, 2006 - 08:58 pm
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Francis mentioned that it was recorded after Sky two, probably 1980, yet he was certain that it was recorded together with March to the Scaffold.
And he himself actually remastered the Sky pieces he wrote, but they never made use of it when reissuing Sky 1 and 2 - and, what a shame, left out Dies Irae completely... |
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| Bill Darlington posted on Sunday, 09 July, 2006 - 12:54 am
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What re-mastering did FM do? The first CD of 'Sky' (Ariola 250 589) was remastered by Chris Blair and Nick Webb. ('Sky' was originally mixed by 'Nick Blair. Is that a pseudonym for those two?)
The second CD (Music Club MCCD 077) included 'Dies Irae' but there is no mention of any further remastering. Who knows who remastered the Sanctuary release (3rd CD; CMRCD1086).
The first CD is the only one to index all five movements of 'Where Opposites Meet' as separate tracks. BTW, the original sleeve notes for 'Opposites Meet' state that it had 'Continuous Necam Mix'. NECAM was an automated, computerised mixing system. (It wasn't digital. The recording and mixes were analogue but the computer recorded what the mixing desk had to do.) If the data for the original mix were retained, it should be possible to remix those tracks completely digitally. |
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| Harald posted on Monday, 10 July, 2006 - 07:04 am
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| As far as I know Francis remastered "his" Sky pieces (privately). Unfortunately even though he offered them to be used on any new release they never were used on the Sanctuary releases. Which is sad, since they sound much better then the originals or the Sanctuary releases. The latter do almost not differ from the originals. |
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| Bill Darlington posted on Monday, 10 July, 2006 - 02:10 pm
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What did he remaster them from? Does this mean that he had master tapes?
If Sanctuary are like any other record company, they might be saving FM's remasters (or were they remixes?) for yet another release, with bonus tracks and fancy packaging, to squeeze a few more quid out of us! |
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| Chris posted on Monday, 10 July, 2006 - 06:39 pm
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Thanks Harald, Bill.
I had a copy of FM's remastered sky tracks. He only remastered his own compositions, plus the piece he demoed in the late 1980s for the band - 'Another Dish on the Roof'. I think I still have the CD somewhere. He did a good job, naturally!!! |
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| Harald posted on Tuesday, 11 July, 2006 - 07:11 am
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Yes, Francis did have or might even still have the master tapes, or a copy of those.
If you want a copy of his rematered pieces, just let me know. |
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| Bill Darlington posted on Tuesday, 11 July, 2006 - 11:57 pm
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I would be VERY interested in getting any of this stuff in the best quality possible. Also any 'unreleased' stuff would be a big bonus. (How do you two come to have this stuff anyway? How come FM had the masters?)
On the question of digital quality, when the prospect of 'Sky' appearing on CD came along, I wrote to their management and asked if the stuff would be remastered or remixed. Peter Lyster-Todd replied that all CDs have to go through a digital mastering. That was unhelpful or even misleading. Any CD has to be mastered from a digital recording but that need not necessarily be a remaster. Many early CDs (and a few recent ones) were dubbed from the LP masters. The RIAA equalisation for LP mastering meant that there was excessive hiss and a fair bit of clipping distortion.
In 1989, in the absence of many Sky albums on CD, I bought the 'classic sky' CD. The disc said 'ADD' (i.e., digitally remixed, promising quality) but the insert card said 'AAD'. I am inclined to believe the latter. |
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| Chris posted on Wednesday, 12 July, 2006 - 01:26 pm
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| As far as I recall, Bill, FM himself sent me a copy of his remastered sky tracks on a cd-r, about six years ago. The demo that he recorded was supplied to me by another member of this forum, who only occasionally posts now. I have a feeling it was called Ánother Dish for the Roof' and was the first movement of another multi-part piece that FM had written for sky in about 1989. I think it ran to almost ten minutes. It was great, with FM playing all the parts, although I think the drums were sequenced. I haven't heard it for a few years now. |
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| Bill Darlington posted on Wednesday, 12 July, 2006 - 08:25 pm
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Any chance of a copy of the tracks and the demo? Unless that would be abusing FM's trust.
In return, I could copy the CD of 'The Long Good Friday', if you don't have it. (No compunction about that because it no longer commercially available!) I am sure that when it does re-appear, it will be remastered and have bonus tracks so you would buy it anyway. :-)
I wouldn't want to post my address but Myke Duncan should have my postal and e-mail adresses |
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| Mike B posted on Thursday, 13 July, 2006 - 07:09 pm
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Bill
send me your e-mail and postal address and I'll burn a copy of the FM remastered stuff |
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| Bill Darlington posted on Thursday, 13 July, 2006 - 09:25 pm
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double U dot darlington at whsmithnet dot co dot uk
If you see what I mean. E-mail me there and I will send my address.
If you don't respond tonight, I'm leaving for the States early tomorrow until 29th July. If you do respond, let me know if there any musical goodies you fancy from there.
If you (or anyone else) can't think of anything right away, I'll email you a couple of phone number where you can reach me in the USA. |
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| Chris posted on Wednesday, 19 July, 2006 - 05:32 pm
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Bill,
Been offline for a few days. I've got the Long Good Friday CD thanks - got it off eBay a few years ago. Sounds like the other forum user (who I alluded to without mentioning his name) has offered to do you the remastered stuff. I hope you like it.
(Greetings, Mike B. Hope you are well...) |
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| Bill_d posted on Thursday, 10 August, 2006 - 09:29 pm
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So, Mike, I'd be grateful for a copy. What do you need?
I don't want to put my e-mail address on here (although it can be deciphered above). |
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| Mike_b posted on Saturday, 12 August, 2006 - 12:06 pm
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Bill
email me your address and I'll post it
mikebreen@supanet.com
just replace CDR with a blank and add one for postage if in UK
Mike |
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