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Next message Chris Drake  posted on Sunday, 05 June, 2005 - 04:33 pm
Best of luck with the new forum - let's hope it's a long time before the spammers find and abuse it. Preferably 'never'.

Here's my first contribution to the new forum...

Apart from the obvious examples (The Long Good Friday, The Deer Hunter, etc...), we all know that the various members of sky have had music (both library and specially composed) used in a wide variety of films and TV shows. For example: Francis Monkman; Did You See?, Think of a Number. Steve Gray; Return of the Saint. Herbie Flowers; The Sweeney. And sky, as a group, Toccata in Ridin' High! (Yes, sorry for reminding everyone about that last one!)

Does anyone have any details of other TV shows or films where sky's music (either collectively or individually) has been used?


Next message Richard posted on Sunday, 05 June, 2005 - 06:47 pm
Talking of Long Good Friday...
Take a look at this - anyone willing to pay a price like that?
(I hope that link works; consider this a test).

As for other movies and TV, I'm sure that as session musos, the band's members have played on a multitude of soundtracks so the list is probably fairly long; finding the credits isn't so easy. Tris did, of coruse, write and play the title music for "Shakespeare in Perspective" in the late 70s.

I do remember a TV quiz back in the mid-80s (it was probably summer 1984) on Sunday afternoons on BBC1 called "The World, The Flesh and the Devil" (it was a sort of religious quiz for theology students, a bit like a specialist University Challenge) that used "The Spirit" as witnessed at the Drury Lane concert and the b-side to the "Fool on the Hill" single. I've also heard snippets of Sahara, Dance of The Little Fairies, Carillon, Westway, Masquerade (and probably more) as background music on various travelogues or natural history programmes.

JW, of course, has played on a few more besides The Deer Hunter (and I never tire of explaining to people that Cavatina was not only not written for that movie, but it wasn't even freshly recorded!), such as Stevie (1978 - my introduction to JW), A Fish Called Wanda, Great Expectations, and he *wrote* the music for a small Aussie film called "Emma's War".

He also plays on the titles of "Rosemary and Thyme" (urgh!) currently on ITV.
Next message Richard posted on Sunday, 05 June, 2005 - 07:30 pm
Just because I'm in a good mood today, and partially in answer to something Bill and I were talking about in emails, here's a few MP3s for those who don't have them (zipped):

Rosemary and Thyme main titles

Emma's War main titles

"The Spirit" (poor recording from vinyl; I need to make a new one)

(from just over 2MB to 4MB in size - you've been warned)
Next message MikeB posted on Sunday, 05 June, 2005 - 08:16 pm
Yes they played on many different programmes.

One of Herbies songs is played as theme to Channel 4 kiddies programme which starts every morning circa 05:50.

All links worked mentioned above too Richard


Next message Chris  posted on Sunday, 05 June, 2005 - 11:58 pm
05.50 in the morning, Mike? I'll shamefully admit that I rarely see that hour!

With regards Cavatina not actually having been written for The Deer Hunter -- if you keep on reminding us, Richard, I'm sure it'll sink in eventually! Actually, I DID remember that this was the case, but couldn't remember the name of the original film and it does tend to be mentioned most often in relation to its Deer Hunter involvement. Incidentally, Hank Marvin often used to point out its origins at Shadows gigs, just before they played their version...

Glad that this message has led to some interesting and informative replies.

By the way, I wonder if any canny film directors have ever asked 'our' John Williams to compose the score for their movies, in the hope that they can profit from any understandable 'misunderstanding' that may arise? The 'other' John Williams is, undoubtedly, one of the most successful and famous film score composers in the world today. In the same way, there is an author by the name of 'Geoffrey Archer', who writes novels, perhaps not dissimilar to those by the similarly named rather more famous author. I doubt that 'Geoffrey's' publishers are too concerned about increased sales that may result from any confusion that may arise. Perhaps John has been asked, more often than we are aware of, to undertake such work, but prefers to concentrate on the performing side of things where, undoubtedly, he too is in a league of his own. Just a thought...

Next message Richard  posted on Monday, 06 June, 2005 - 12:54 am
The confusion between the two JWs is quite astonishingly widespread and so I'm absolutely certain that professional music commissioners get mistaken almost as much as Joe Public.

I make a habit in record shops of tidying up their "John Williams" collections - rarely have I seen the "Classical - Instrumental" and "Soundtracks" departments without one or the other having his CDs misfiled... Some catalogues attempt at distinguishing them, sometimes by use of middle initials (John Christopher -v- John Towner, which most people would find very useful, I'm sure!) or by date of birth (1941 -v- 1932, just as useful to the majority of people!).

Matters aren't helped by the fact that they're contracted to the same record company and represented by the same management company. In some way, however, I suppose it's helpful as representatives of either are able immediately to steer conversation in the right direction.

I do recall an after-gig conversation in 1980(ish) when a (young) member of the audience asked JCW why he'd not played any Star Wars pieces during the gig. JCW looked like he was used to it and disabused the kid in a friendly and patient way, although the boy didn't seem convinced.

As it happens, whilst I'm not a huge fan of the other JW (I find his material a bit repetitive) I am a huge fan of film music (Dany Elfman rules!) and notice it more than the casual film-goer. My brother is a huge soundtrack buff (his LP collection alone is literally in the thousands, and his CD collection is twice that) and owns a copy of every JTW score ever recorded to disk.

My own copy of Emma's War was acquired by him back when it was new because the shopkeeper at one of his favourite haunts (who knew him and of his collection) thrust it at him insisting it was a JTW score. One look at the cover was enough for my brother to lose interest, but he took it on my behalf (I'd been looking for it for a while). We have had fun moments at home when references were made to "my JW" and "his JW"). ;-)

The credits on the Emma's war DVD (both on the cover and on-screen) state "Music Composed and Played by Guitarist JOHN WILLIAMS" which I think is rather fun. ;-)

(As for the Cavatina story, I'm aware that I've said it more often than is probably good for me on the old forum, and I assume that all the regulars are tired of it, but I operate on the principle that the truth can never be repeated too often, especially when it's not well known; the original film, incidentally, was called "The Walking Stick" - a film which I dearly want to see released on DVD, or even VHS, just because I'm an obsessed completist!)
Next message Mike posted on Monday, 06 June, 2005 - 01:09 am
The IMdb site - Internet Movie Database

Lists under Trivia:
"The Walking Stick" 1970 - The film's composer Stanley Myers originally wrote his classic "Cavatina" for this film, but instead it ended up as the theme music on the soundtrack for The Deer Hunter (1978).

Its interesting to learn from all you knowledgable people.

Next message Bill Darlington posted on Monday, 06 June, 2005 - 10:33 am
Part of Sky's "Where Opposites Meet" was used as the theme for a current affairs programme. "Current Account", I think.

Two others were used on a BBC holiday programme (the one with Frank Bough). "El Cielo" and (I think) "Gavotte & Variations".
Next message Mike B posted on Monday, 06 June, 2005 - 11:20 pm

Emma's War main titles

Lovely song

Rosemary and Thyme main titles

Won't play says zip file is part of spanned zip

"The Spirit"

WOn't play in Windows Media

Can you assit the pain (me) Richard thanks. I'm intrigued to here

Next message Richard posted on Tuesday, 07 June, 2005 - 12:56 am

I've just downloaded the zip files myself and they unzipped and played fine in two compression programs and three media players... Considering nobody else has reported any problems, I can only assume that you've sufferred from an incomplete download or something.

The exact file sizes should be:
R&T: ZIP: 4,868,078 bytes /MP3: 4,950,705 bytes
Spirit: ZIP: 2,832,439 bytes /MP3: 2,897,324 bytes

If the file sizes you have are different, I suggest you re-download.

If you're still having problems and you can wait, as we'll be meeting in a couple of weeks, you'll get copies then (among other items...).
Next message Bill posted on Tuesday, 07 June, 2005 - 11:25 am
MP3s are already compressed and your ZIPs made little saving (only about 2% smaller). Would it be easier just to post the MP3s?
Next message Richard posted on Tuesday, 07 June, 2005 - 01:01 pm
Yes, it would've. I have my reasons...
Next message Chris  posted on Tuesday, 07 June, 2005 - 10:35 pm
Bearing in mind that these two guys work so prolifically in their respective areas of the world music industry, I am surprised that they have not done something along the lines that Richard mentioned to differentiate between them. Or maybe they just assume that the difference is obvious?

I will admit that, a long time ago, I used to labour under the illusion that they were one and the same (in the late 70s/1980, maybe) and have encountered at least one other person who has been resolutely of the belief that sky's John Williams is also the prolific film composer!

Let's not forget that one of Francis's tunes from 'Virtual Classics' can be heard most Sundays as the theme to Jonathan Dimbleby's lunchtime programme on ITV. Apparently, the fact that FM is credited is unusual, as this tends not to happen with pieces of library music. Just think about the sheer amount of library music we have all heard over the years (on TV shows, adverts, radio, cinema, etc...) that has been penned and performed by the various members of sky without us ever knowing. I am certain that, along with Francis, Steve Gray has been especially busy in this field, as, I'm sure, have Herbie and Tris. I know that one of Steve's compositions (made with Brian Bennett and, I think, Ron Asprey, as WASP) was used as the theme to a BBC drama series in the 70s and the single version can fetch high prices on eBay.

I am very much of the opinion that collections of such library music really ought to be made available on CD, as with the recent 'Aim High - Brian Bennett at KPM' CD. I have an unofficial CD-R of Francis's library music from 1978-1980 and it makes for fantastic listening. I for one would be more than happy to buy such CDs and especially happy to think that the guys were receiving the recognition and financial remuneration for the work that they deserve.

Next message Richard posted on Saturday, 11 June, 2005 - 12:52 pm
As for the confusion between the two JWs, I thought a golden opportunity was lost a few years ago when JTW was engaged to write the score for a film called "Stepmom" (a crap weepie by Chris Columbus, previously famous for the first two Home Alones, now more famous for the first two Harry Potters).

Anyway, JTW's score revolves around the classical guitar and he engaged Christopher Parkening to record it (I think they're mates). It would have been wonderful if he'd got JCW instead. Think of the confusion THAT would've caused!

As for library music, I think that CDs would actually make such collections more effective (being bits and bytes, they can be more easily added to databases and all sorts). Actually, I assume that most library music created nowadays is stored and transmitted digitally anyway. I'll bet that the big libraries (KPM, Bruton, etc) have probably digitised most of their collections, but seeing as these are not generally meant for public use but for professionals, I doubt they're likely to be widely available (much like library music LPs, really).

Actually, a little Googling has turned up

KPM's site (that page lists their composers, which strangely don't include KP, FM or SG);

Bruton Music (now BMGZomba - wonderful name; dreadful site IMO!).
Next message Douglas Milne posted on Tuesday, 14 June, 2005 - 12:43 am
As I recall, Where Opposites Meet 5 was used as the theme for something called "Landward" on Sunday lunchtimes during the early 1980s. I'm pretty certain John Craven was the presenter.

Next message Andy Taylor  posted on Friday, 08 July, 2005 - 10:40 pm
Some of the Cadmium tracks were used on a TV show called "Solo" which starred Felicity Kendall and Stephen Moore.
Next message Chris posted on Tuesday, 26 July, 2005 - 02:27 am
I went down to see one of my friends tonight, who collects old video tapes and machines. He had just received a batch of Philips N1500 and N1700 tapes, recorded off the TV in the 1970s/80s. He was looking through one of them when I arrived and, by a strange coincidence, it contained some editions of Shakespeare in Perspective. The theme music, played entirely on percussion, sounded very familiar! For those who have never seen the propramme or heard the music, just think of 'Tristan's Magic Garden'.

A few hours later (yes I know, I must be a glutton for punishment!), we were watching some linking pieces and programme trailers (probably from the early 80s) and what should be playing in the background of one of them -- Francis Monkman's library track which was also used as the theme to, I believe, Think of a Number. Bizarre, eh? Proof, if proof be needed, that the various members of sky were nothing less than prolific in their own right prior to forming the band.

Who knows what other little gems these old tapes may contain...
Next message Matt L posted on Wednesday, 24 August, 2005 - 09:48 pm
Also to add to this, one episode of the BBC's Great Railway jounies of the world. The episode went from East to West and also travelled up the branch to Alice Springs. Tracks i remember being used were, Where Opp Meet, bits of 1/2/3/4/5 and for the barren desert scence, the eerie sound of the end of Scherzo was used from the 4 movemnet Fifo (just before the starter riff for Watching the Aeroplanes). Danza was used as well, I think.

It was only this posting topic that sent that whirling out of the archives of my mind. Hadn't thought about it since watching the programme in about 1981/2. My memory isn't as bad as I thought, wow!
Next message whyperion posted on Thursday, 01 September, 2005 - 03:21 am
Tristan Fry I remembered from the 1970s BBC Schools Programme(s) on Music - ( not Time and Tune but on of the others ) doing over two or three programmes introduction and examples of types of Percussion.
Next message phill rowley  posted on Saturday, 03 September, 2005 - 03:01 pm
hi is there anywhere i can get sky mp3s?
its really annoying cos i broke my only cd when i trod on it thanks
Next message les stokes  posted on Tuesday, 06 September, 2005 - 07:17 pm
the great railway journeys from my poor old brain the dance of the little
fairies was also used as the train ambles along across oz towards perth.
can any one confirm this?
les stokes
Next message Mike  posted on Sunday, 11 September, 2005 - 11:20 pm

All of the Great railway journey across Oz was Sky if only I could get the video or DVD

BTW how are you

Next message Tricky posted on Thursday, 15 September, 2005 - 08:16 pm
Great Railway Journeys are currently being broadcast by BBC 4 (Freeview). The BBC is also selling the Michael Palin set - check out the price!. If you can find out when the Oz one's are broadcast I'll try to record them (on my new dvd/hdd recorder!).
Next message Chris posted on Friday, 16 September, 2005 - 10:31 am
Strangely enough, I watched the Michael Palin Great Train Journey (the first one) a couple of weeks ago at a friends' house. Actually quite good. He had the Palin box set. Also watched a couple of episodes of his Hemingway series. I'm thinking of buying the boxset for my parents for Christmas - but I gather it's rather expensive! I'll check out the link you provided. Or there's always
Next message Bill D posted on Friday, 16 September, 2005 - 11:23 am
...or there's always FOPP, if you have one near you. They often have great bargains on things like that, although not necessarily when they are first released.

(Best stock/range is in the one in Glasgow City Centre.)
Next message Tricky posted on Saturday, 17 September, 2005 - 08:49 pm also lists the "World's Greatest Railway Journeys" (12 Discs @ 27.99) - NOT with Michael Palin. Note Disc 5: Australia - Sydney Monorail, The Orient Express, The Ghan Train.

MP's dvd set doesn't mention Oz at all. Your guess is as good as mine!
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